Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Anonymous

Anonymous

Mise à jour il y a 12w

UPDATE 1. On October 16 2017 Novaya Gazeta hosted a press-conference with a man held in captivity in Chechnya for being gay. He is the first who decided to submit a legal claim and speak up before the camera.

UPDATE 2. A Chechen singer by the name Zelimkhan Bakayev is told to be either killed or kept in captivity. The Chechen authorities are trying to deny this in various questionable ways. A video meant to prove he was alive and in Germany seems to be fake.

UPDATE 3. July, 2018. In St Petersburg, another guy by the name Zelimkhan, who was hiding from persecution in a Russian LGBT network’s shelter, was kidnapped by his father and brothers. Fortunately, the police managed to track and find them. At the moment, they all are in the police department. It’s unclear what will happen next.

Пришла смс: «Помоги мне»

«Это наш мужчина, наши дела, и мы сами разберемся»

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

UPDATE 4. Z.Bakayev, mentioned in the update 2, is reported to be dead. R.Kadyrov’s words on his death neither implied sorrow nor condemnation of kidnappers and killers. Quite much the opposite, he called Z.Bakayev “some shit” and stated that men of the Bakaevs clan “solved the problem on their own”.

«Это наш мужчина, наши дела, и мы сами разберемся»

***

The original question: Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it? Chechnya gay concentration camp horror as reported by the Toronto Sun on April 10, 2017

MY DISCLAIMER: Disturbing reading, not a politically correct one, because the issue discussed is not politically correct itself. If you don’t like this sort of stuff, don’t read this. As I am from Russia and was acquainted with some Chechens and Ingushes, I think I am entitled to add my 2 cents.

If a story like this was told about Ryazan or Kazan, I would say ‘it’s an absolute bull’s hit’. But as this is reported about Chechnya, I’m damn sure that it really could happen. Why? Because the slogan ‘nothing is impossible’ was created for Chechnya.

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Welcome to the Principality of Chechnya, which inherited from the Middle Ages a bit more than just these towers. A feudal monarchy in the XXI century’s Europe? Chechnya. Nothing is impossible.

Any democratic forms of management failed here. When in the late 1980s early 1990s the Soviet government’s grip loosened, various forms of violence had flooded the region well before any official military actions began. Russian nationalist often say that back then every third Russian woman in Chechnya was raped. I don’t claim this number 33% is precise, probably the percentage was lower. Should I say that the vast majority of Russians fled and now only 1.9% of the Chechnya’s population are Russians versus 31% in 1979?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

In the 1990-s many groups struggling for power emerged and started fighting, constantly making and breaking alliances. One could equally describe them as guerillas, valiant fighters for freedom, head cutters, thugs, etc.. Major international media usually preferred the second definition and silenced the head cutting.

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Some people used to make videos of decapitations long before ISIS made it a trend.

One should mention that many Chechens highly value the traditions of their clans and follow the way the clans interacted centuries ago. Some of them talk about this, some act upon their words.

…In Yeltsin’s time he was just a boy, but in Putin’s he started wearing a dagger and telling he was a duke.

-Are you crazy? You’re a postgrad in Comparative Sociology!

-No, I am a Chechen duke, and my vassals are dying in Grozny, [email protected]#k you!

(“A Farewell to Nationality. Thoughts after Auschwitz”, an article in Russian))

Local Chechen news blocks sometimes show reports on reconciliation after conflicts between clans. If these two clans didn’t reconcile, there would have been bloody revenge (vendetta). Watch this video, it’s a must.

il y en a beaucoup d'autres.

So, after the bloody 1990-s and questionable military success Putin wanted to keep the peace there and offered a form of management which would make more sense to the Caucasus’ highlanders than liberasty. Feudalism.

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

The highlanders depicted are not from Chechnya, but there are certains similarities between them.

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Putin supported one of the fighting groups and granted it absolute local power and hell lots of money they could use uncontrolled in exchange for the absolute loyalty. This would guarantee the stability and submission to the Moscow Crown. It worked.

So, Ramzan Kadyrov inherited his father’s throne and now he is the Prince of Chechnya and a vassal of Vladimir of All Russia. Russian heralds praise Vladimir for peace in Chechnya but many Russian taxpayers think that Russia actually lost the wars to Chechnya and now Russians pay a huge tribute for maintaining that relative peace. With these huge money prince Kadyrov builds castles, palaces, invites foreign gladiators and mummers. By the way, after ingesting all those “investments” Chechnya still has the 3rd out of 90 lowest regional GDP per capita in Russia, approximately equal to the one of Philippines.

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Kadyrov said he was Putin’s personal warrior willing to do anything "Я пехотинец Путина": резонансные заявления Рамзана Кадырова Due to this absolute loyalty to Putin and importance to keep the region pacified, Kadyrov is untouchable. Once his people tortured a Moscow FSB (you call it KGB) officer and raped him by a pool-stick. They escaped any charges, although FSB, a.k.a. the Sovereign’s Oprichnina is usually thought to have exceptionally high status. Сотрудники ФСБ анонимно пожаловались на освобождение охранников Кадырова https://www.novayagazeta.ru/arti...

Laws of the Russian Federation, you say. They don’t act in Chechnya. Polygyny is unconstitutional in Russia. Marriages are allowed from the age of 18, but the 57 y.o. (others say, 46) Baron Guchigov married a 17 y.o. girl in addition to his older wife (she wears a blue headscarf on the pic). The girl didn’t look happy at the ceremony. Guchigov is the head of the Nozhay-Yurt county police, he is supposed to guarantee the law-abidingness there.

Please notice the Lord Daudov, wearing black, he is Prince Kadyrov’s chamberlain and advisor. The fact that he attended the wedding meant that His Highness approved it. In spite of a nationwide public scandal the marriage finally happened. Very that Lord, according to Novaya Gazeta, visited the alleged secret prison where gay men were kept and tortured.

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

Wedding scandal puts Putin in a bind: Head of brutal Chechen police force, 46, marries shy beauty, 17

So, once again, nothing is impossible in Chechnya. The vast majority of Russians would be happy to see it apart from Russia with a tall wall on the border, but with Chechnya’s economy potential and aggressive culture that would quickly result in a bloodbath and a refugee crisis more terrible than the wars of 1990-s.

As for homosexual people, the problem is much bigger than this cutie, previously known for his calls to “kill as many Russians as possible” and boasting of killing his first Russian at the age of 16. He might have decided to take some action on what he saw as ungodly, but honor killings existed far before him and will stay after he’s gone.

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

With the ultraconservative hypermasculine culture the Northern Caucasus has, it’s no surprise that those who don’t meet the standards of masculinity are persecuted by their own relatives. As Novaya Gazeta stated, the honor killings are the main danger for men thought to be homosexual [ Убийство чести], as well as for unfaithful wives, non-virgin brides etc.. Hommages à l'honneur means that as long as the shameful person is alive, every single person of the clan is compromised. The reputation of the clan can only be restored through the murder of the “bad” member.

I have to admit that whoever rules Russia and whatever Moscow will do, the situation is unlikely to improve a lot soon, like this doesn’t happen in Pakistan. That’s it. Northern Caucasus, especially Chechnya, is a piece of Pakistan or Zimbabwe in Russia. Just to remind you, legal persecution and execution of homosexual men is practiced in many states the Western nations have stable economical and friendly political relations with.

Is there any truth to the story of Chechnya setting up a concentration camp for gay people, and if so, what can be done about it?

The best thing that can be done right now is a donation to The Russian LGBT Net that is currently evacuating endangered people from Chechnya. A higher level of activities would be creating an institution with a branch office in Caucasus to evacuate people abroad and help them with adaptation.

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Kenzi Mudge

Kenzi Mudge, LGBTQ Poly Queer Ace Lesbian and Advocate

Répondu il y a 79w · L'auteur dispose de réponses 929 et de vues de réponses 611.3k

I’m so glad you’re asking about this.

According to a simple Google Search (as of today, the Chechnya gay concentration camp is dominating the news), yes, there is truth to the story.

Gay people are regularly asked if there is credibility to various claims of discrimination. The marriage equality law in the US was seen as the final equality step and nothing more can be done.

So step 1:

Acknowledge the issue is bigger than Chechnya. You can help a lot of LGBT people this way. There are about 100 people in the Chechnya camp, but many more LGBT people are facing big problems worldwide.

Étape 2 :

Understand the problem in Chechnya specifically: There is a lot going on politically in Chechnya that transcends the LGBT issue; understand Chechnya: What Can Be Done?, et Chechnya - Wikipedia

Worldwide understanding and croyance that the issue is real can go a long way toward making US and international political entities take action, and you can donate money and time as well. Les protestations du public is very powerful, so be outspoken!

And last, the Russian LGBT Network is working to get people out. Reach out to them and see if you can help.

Jon Harley

Jon Harley, bi man in a same-sex marriage

Mise à jour il y a 79w · L'auteur dispose de réponses 1.3k et de vues de réponses 2.2m

Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, a Russian newspaper and an organization called “Russian LGBT Network” say it’s true. Statements from the latter seem credible and are being widely reported.

Chechens tell of prison beatings and electric shocks in anti-gay purge - the Guardian newspaper interviewed one of the victims.

A spokesman for the leader of Chechnya has denied this on the basis that LGBT people do not exist. The concentration camp he would prefer us not to know about is in the town of Argun, and the round-up seems to have been going on since the start of April 2017.

You can bet it’s not just gay men they’re rounding up, but also bi men, trans people and probably anyone not conforming to their medieval ideas about gender.

What can be done? Chechnya is part of Russia and is just the extreme end of the persecution of LGBT people which has been Russian policy since 2013. So the question is really, what can be done about human rights in Russia?

Grigory Yakushev

Grigory Yakushev, worked at NVIDIA (2016-2018)

Répondu il y a 80w · L'auteur dispose de réponses 308 et de vues de réponses 3.5m

Réponse d'origine: What can be done about the systematic roundups and killings of gay men in Chechnya?

I suspect you are talking about this recent crackdown: Gay Men Are Being Rounded Up And Killed In Chechnya: Report

A global outcry would certainly help. If high-profile activists, politicians, actors, singers etc. weigh in and publicly condemn it - the crackdown will probably stop.

Otherwise not much: Chechnya is ruled by Kadyrov as his private estate, even Putin doesn’t have real power there.

Sherif Abbassy

Sherif Abbassy

Répondu il y a 78w · L'auteur dispose de réponses 730 et de vues de réponses 281.6k

Réponse d'origine: Why are gays in Chechnya being put in concentration camps?

Answering Mary Phillips — Chechnya follows the Islamic religious code:

Coran

Quran (7:80-84) - "...For ye practice your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds.... And we rained down on them a shower (of brimstone)" - An account that is borrowed from the Biblical story of Sodom. Muslim scholars through the centuries have interpreted the "rain of stones" on the town as meaning that homosexuals should be stoned, since no other reason is given for the people's destruction. (Inexplicably, the story is also repeated in suras 15:74, 27:58 et 29:40).

Quran (7:81) - "Will ye commit abomination such as no creature ever did before you?" This verse is part of the previous text and it establishes that homosexuality as different from (and much worse than) adultery or other sexual sin. According to the Arabic grammar, homosexuality is called le worst sin, while references elsewhere describe other forms of non-marital sex as being "among great sins."

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Quran (26:165-166) - "Of all the creatures in the world, will ye approach males, "And leave those whom Allah has created for you to be your mates? Nay, ye are a people transgressing"

Quran (4:16) - "If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone" This is the Yusuf Ali translation. The original Arabic does not use the word "men" and simply says "two from among you." Yusuf Ali may have added the word "men" because the verse seems to refer to a different set than referred to in the prior verse (explicitly denoted as "your women"). In other words, since 4:15 refers to "your women", 4:16 is presumably written to and refers to men.

There are several places in the Quran where the story of Sodom is repeated, with emphasis placed on the destruction of the town for homosexual lewdness.

Although some Muslim political leaders in the West join with social liberals in alliances that sometimes include peripheral support for gay rights and civil unions, this appears to be more a matter of expediency than genuine concern.

Nikolay Matyushev

Nikolay Matyushev, worked at Parallels

Répondu il y a 80w · L'auteur dispose de réponses 1.2k et de vues de réponses 1m

Réponse d'origine: What can be done about the systematic roundups and killings of gay men in Chechnya?

Zero: start by learning from primary sources if there’s actually a problem. Article in question doesn’t contain any facts - names, number of incidents, locations etc. Chechen republic is traditionally a place with more than usual criminal abductions and there’s no evidence provided that those are sexual orientation motivated.

Then, after getting credible evidence write to Attorney General or Investigation Committee. If you fear that Chechen republican offices are not going to make fair case / inquiry address central offices directly using on-line form.

Second, wait for the term specified by law to get the response. Complain if it was delayed beyond established threshold.

Third, ask civil activists to support your case.

Vladimir Lebedev-Schmidthof

Vladimir Lebedev-Schmidthof, works at Transas

Répondu il y a 80w · L'auteur dispose de réponses 605 et de vues de réponses 562.4k

Réponse d'origine: What can be done about the systematic roundups and killings of gay men in Chechnya?

Organize a free education programs (schools, colleges) for ethnic Chechens (inside Chechnya if possible, outside Chechnya as well) with secular “westernized” point of view, including gay rights and whatever else you want to protect.

Make this education that good so Chechen person after that school could attend some decent Western university.

Keep up for a hundred years.

I’ll support you.

Sophia de Tricht

Sophia de Tricht, I'm an L and a T. So... That's fun, I guess...

Répondu il y a 80w · L'auteur dispose de réponses 6.8k et de vues de réponses 23.7m

Réponse d'origine: What can be done about the systematic roundups and killings of gay men in Chechnya?

Sigh… Well, Chechnya is and has been a disaster my entire life and there’s nothing that an outsider can do.

And there’s no internal will to fix it.

Soooooo…

Ouais.

That’s not great.

C'est ne pas génial.

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